User talk:PVJ59/Archive 2

Your Wikinews career so far

Not bad. FellowWikiNews (W) 02:46, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

I was going to protect his talk page but you beat me to it! FellowWikiNews (W) 13:43, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Vice-Admiral Mehta appointed Chief of Naval Staff

Thank you for the article, however it's quite small. Do you have any plans on expanding it? Because if not, I might merge it with the Wikinews Shorts page. —this is messedrocker (talk) 08:36, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Ghana bans gay and lesbian conference

Regarding your move of the above article, I moved it back. The word illegal would be misleading in the title - the spokesperson herself admoits the conference is not illegal, just discouraged!! Just thought I'd let you know my reasoning as a point of courtesy :D --Errant 11:06, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh yes homosexuality is illegal but the conference itself is not - which is what the title says. Straight from the mouth of the information minister: "It's not illegal for them to meet and talk, but we in Ghana don't want to encourage it. They can go and do it elsewhere" added Bartels. I won't move it back until you are in agtreement. If you still arn't happy with removing illegal from the title maybe we can come up with an alternate title :D --Errant 11:45, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks --Errant 11:57, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

None taken

But as regards Neutralizer, his apology is of course false; he's made the same apology at least 3 times I can recall. - Amgine | ^{m | en.WN} 14:58, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your post

I very much liked your follow up to Romanian oil company claims Iran has seized one of its rigs. Stuff outside of the news is background noise, and doesn't bother me, even though I noise back at it at times. Best regards, -Edbrown05 08:04, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

IP blocks

hi, just wanted to point out that User:68.76.87.118 uses a dynamically allocated IP address - the IP address is allocated to different users by the ISP at different times, so one shouldn't block such IP address indefinitely, since it is likely to be used by a completely different user sometime later, one who has probably not indulged in vandalism.

as Special:Blockip says, "Do not block any IP address indefinitely unless it is an open proxy." Wikinews:Blocking policy also states "For dynamic IPs, such blocks [i.e. for disruption] should last 24 hours" and has a section on Accidental blocks.

incidentally, for blocks and other admin actions that are applied "at leisure", many admins find it helpful to read thro' the relevant policy just before doing the action, even if they are experienced and believe that they understand the policy fairly well. it's a good practice, helps prevent mistakes.

one place to check who the IP address is allocated to is ARIN. for 68..., ARIN says its part of a PPPoX Pool used by Southwestern Bell. Doldrums 16:56, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

i think it normally takes a great deal more vandalism and disruption before we go pursue the matter with the ISP. this, i think, is "common" or "garden" vandalism, handled by a li'l bit of blocking. u can, however, keep an eye out for vandalism from the same range of IPs, which might be from the same user. Doldrums 17:18, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Please stay

I heard a rumour that you're considering leaving Wikinews. I just wanted to say that, you're a very useful contributor around here, and hope you stay. Sincerrly, Bawolff ☺☻ 03:36, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes... you're dedicated enough to become an admin... then you decide you want to contribute to a stagnating popularity? That doesn't make much sense to me. —this is messedrocker (talk) 03:37, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

It may not be the easiest way to communicate, with the way things are done here on a text basis. But text over voice is the only way to cut through the clutter of the cacophony of voices and clarifies, boldly, what your or my thought was. Your point on watercooler/policy was well taken by me. I didn't handle my edit to your post well at all, but it sprang from a belief that there is already a diverse range of contributors here (and I'm not saying it couldn't be more diverse). If I could take back many of my posts, I would... but then again maybe I don't have to, because where it matters, other contributor actions amend my efforts at making this a better news environment. -Edbrown05 04:24, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

nothing personnal !

even if i do not agree with some of your POV, please don't feel hurted ! it's interresting. Jacques Divol 14:45, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Templates on Indian articles

Just to save you a few keystrokes... {{Template:India}} is exactly the same as {{India}}, the curly brackets indicate to the wiki software that the first place to look for the data to include is in the template namespace. So, (if I understand correctly) coding {{Template:India}} causes the software to look for Template:Template:India, that fails and it falls back to Template:India.

Not just me that manually fixes it, the AutoWikiBrowser also makes the same correction. :-) --Brian McNeil / ^talk 18:47, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

"How to:Breaking news"

Hi PVJ, I wanted to put this news Damascus:US embassy attacked as breaking news... Can you tell me how?

(Editorinsaif 09:37, 12 September 2006 (UTC))

Thanks PVJ (Editorinsaif 10:03, 12 September 2006 (UTC))

Personal attacks

Many of the comments you have made recently on the article about the Pope would be deeply offensive to a devout Catholic. I would like to remind you that throwing around slurs such as "Kommandant Ratsinger" is not appropriate for Wikinews and indicative of an unwillingness to make positive contributions where your opinion is a minority position. --Brian McNeil / ^talk 13:22, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

Can you stop calling the Pope a Nazi? Those may be very offensive to Catholics and in general sound rude. How do you know if he is still a Nazi? Can you tell me that?

Quote

---

Ratzinger was enrolled in the Hitler Youth; Membership being legally required after December 1936.[2] Ratzinger has stated he was an unenthusiastic member who refused to attend meetings. His father was a bitter enemy of Nazism, believing it conflicted with the Catholic faith.

The unfortunate fact that most Muslim countries do not recognize Israel as a country is not a POV, it is denial.--71.227.156.73 06:46, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Pope comments article

i've moved this back to develop. the Nazi thing is not relevant to the current issue, and to insist that it is, sans any substantiation is simply povioring. please collaborate to make this article reflect WN:NPOV, not the POV that you subscribe to. Doldrums 04:20, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

revert

i've xplained my reason for revert on the article talk page. i expect u to do the same. Doldrums 14:30, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

hi!

can u log on to the IRC channel? thx, Doldrums 14:47, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Accreditation Requests

Added my statement to Wikinews:Accreditation requests, I hope you change your mind.terinjokes _{User Page} / ^Talk 10:03, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, discounted, I misread the policy, it states I must solicate WN users, not my AIM contact list ;-) terinjokes _{User Page} / ^Talk 03:11, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

terrorism template

here's a viable solution - remove the template and answer the concerns raised on the water cooler discussion. Doldrums 14:05, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Unblocked

You were unblocked, because you weren't blocked for enforcing neutrality, you were edit warring.

DO NOT EDIT WAR.

Violating WN:3RR is not allowed.

—this is messedrocker (talk) 19:18, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Wikistar Nomination

I nominated you on the Wikistar Program for your never-ending efforts contributing towards wikinews. Please click here for more info. Zer T 01:17, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for coming back

We need as many Wikinewsies from underrepresented areas like Asia as we can get. Anyways, if you feel certain articles could use a neutralizing, you will find you will have the best luck (a) being calm about it, (b) avoid commenting in ways that'll piss off other people, (c) be friendly (d) not edit warring. I wish you the best of luck. —this is messedrocker (talk) 13:14, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

You're welcome, and thank you for the kind words. It's a good thing if you stay, because if you were to leave, you'd be leaving on a note of "we need more people like me with non-West POVs so I'm leaving," which frankly doesn't make much sense. Thank you again for staying, and if you feel stressed about something, just approach it calmly, and take occasional breaks if necessary. Remember, only you can stress yourself out. —this is messedrocker (talk) 15:52, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Admin vote

Thanks for supporting my successful admin nomination! I will try to live up to the confidence that's been shown in me. Crimson 17:18, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

suggest you avoid editing some articles

You seem to have very strong feelings on issue relating to India, Islam, and Israel. I suggest you recuse yourself from articles that touch on these subjects, since its hard to stay NPOV when you have your own opinion. TRWBW 14:37, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Sindhi Wikinews

There is a person who has been wnodering why yhr Wikinews Logo is not appearing on the main page of Wikinews Sindhi. I cannot read the anguage, which I assume is Arabic and since you are in India I am messaging you to see if you can read the language and possibly find out why the logo is not available. Since I cannot read it, I cannot help. If you cannot read it then Sorry to bother you. The users name that was asking about it is Zafar on Sindhi Wikinews. Jason Safoutin 22:42, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

FYI, Wikinews:Admin_action_alerts#User:Dr2tom

I didn't see anything other than an attempt to promote a business technique with a press release/bogus article. Do you really think that merits a lifetime ban? I've not checked further back in Recent Changes but it'd have to be someone pretty determined to spam us, say using a bot, before I'd go for a permaban. --Brian McNeil / ^talk 18:33, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

I think that banning forever on first offfense is too much, so I've changed his block to three days. If you really feel he must be blocked, feel free to revert me - I'm not attached to the issue. Bawolff ☺☻ 03:42, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Neutralizer sockpuppets category

That is true, however, Yrtsihpos was indeed verified to be a sockpuppet in Checkuser. —this is messedrocker (talk) 10:50, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

To build the category I went through the entire blocklist and added every account that had been permanently blocked as a sockpuppet of Neutralizer. They should all have had Checkuser carried out at the time before issuing a permanent block. If you go here and do a text search for "Neutralizer" you'll see how I got the list for the category. --Brian McNeil / ^talk 12:08, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

New video shows 9/11 hijackers attending Al-Qaeda camp in Afghanistan

I see that you decided NOT to discuss the resoning of "terroist camp" here. It is NOT a pov in this case. Osama Bin Laden is a terrorist and speaking to terrorists at a terrorist camp. Prove to me that its not a terrorist camp otherwise terrorist IS NPOV in this case. I await your reply. Jason Safoutin 20:43, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Sheesh

I had punctuation once, then somehow it got lost editting Wikinews, ! -Edbrown05 05:18, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Best regards. -Edbrown05 05:35, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikinews:Protection policy

 —Doldrums (talk) 16:02, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

that user is not the only one to be "edit warring" and "pov-pushing" on that page. i would suggest that u unprotect the page, not block the user, and resolve the editorial dispute on the talk page.  —Doldrums (talk) 16:11, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

I just took the time to read some of the other coments on this users page. I'm sorry I got upset and took his attacks on me personally. I now see this editor is a habitual antagonist and gets in POV/NPOV arguments and revert wars often. I feel silly now.64.192.249.2 18:39, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

3RR

PVJ, please note that you've made four revisions to the article Small aircraft crashes into NYC building - Alert to remain unchanged. [1] [2] [3] [4] Please note that this is actually against the three-revert rule. As an administrator, I hope that you will uphold our site's policies. -- IlyaHaykinson 16:27, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

running amok

There's a word for you, "amok". See if you can look that up, or find it in English language translation, because Little Miss run "amok" is fucking dead. Judy Miller died when she dried up in front of a judge. And your Israel bullshit is ... bucking up against "yeah, alright already, and who cares... " -Edbrown05 09:55, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Re: Gee, and I thought you were a big boy, sadly, I suppose you are not when you resort to threats of blocking me because you don't like the way I addressed you. Perhaps you also haven't given much consideration to how you have addressed Wikinews. Please do. -Edbrown05 01:39, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

And quit being a brat. -Edbrown05 01:59, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

speedy delete

pvj, the article on Iran prohibiting high-speed internet access shld not have been speedied. the article reported the news accurately, and with sufficint clarity for sources to be found and article developed. please speedy delete articles carefully, checking the WN:SD and WN:DR before doing so. administrator buttons should be used with due care and must be used in conforming to policy. the use of administrative powers to exercise editorial control over what Wikinews is a big no-no.

if u have concerns about the authenticity of the event, u can note them on the talk page and tag the article, if needed. as WN:SD states, only "Obvious hoaxes" shld be speedied.

RfA thanks

Hi PVJ59,

thanks for voting in my RfA, which passed 4/1/0... not a big crowd but I'll still try to be the best admin I can be. If you have any advice for me, or need help, you know where to find me!

--Steven Fruitsmaak (Reply) 20:42, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Alert

Adminstrator Alert page is for requesting adminstrators' help. i've pointed out in the alert that a long-published article has been unpublished becasue one user is looking for sources to substantiate his allegations of bias, allegations which many others have disagreed with time and again, on this page and others. so ur actions are pov-pushing and the unpublishing a disruption.  — Doldrums(talk) 13:37, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

sources provided? substantiating that 24 countries dont think Israel exists?  — Doldrums(talk) 13:42, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

hezbollah's view of israel is not notable enough to be tagged to every mention of Israel.  — Doldrums(talk) 13:47, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

yes. not notable enough to be tagged to every mention of the word israel. just like every mention of Hezbollah is not tagged with what one particular Israeli party leader thinks of it.  — Doldrums(talk) 13:54, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

i wont, 'coz it's not notable enough to be added everywhere. just like Hezbollah's isn't.  — Doldrums(talk) 13:57, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

WN:3RR

read it.  — Doldrums(talk) 13:41, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

RE POV pushing

I have never banned you nor do I have any intentions of doing so. I have the right to express what I think you are doing or not doing for or against the project. Do not threaten me. If you do not like what I have to say then don't start a war. If you cannot accept the fact that this Wiki is ALL equal then leave. Do not start wars based on your own personal agenda. And again, I do not take threats lightly. Jason Safoutin 19:25, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

I also UNBANNED you as 1) self blocks are not allowed 2) an indefiante ban is just plain dumb. You may be opinionated, but as far as I can see, but may be wrong, you did not violate policy nor did you violate your Admin privilages. Jason Safoutin 19:40, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

And I never said you have the inability to be equal. I simply siad if you cannot accept the fact that we are all equal here on WN then don't edit. I also NEVER once told you to leave. I gave the option of doing so if you hate WN and it's users so much. Jason Safoutin 19:42, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't hate WN or its users, but have realised that becoming too emotionally involved in the project will benefit nobody. I apologise for allowing things to get out of hand and request that I be unblocked so that I may return to editing. I ask that I be unblocked so that I may continue writing for the project. I feel that I must also apologise to you, Doldrums, for engaging in edit-warring and hope that you will not let those regrettable events come in the way of our working together effectively on the project. PVJ^(Talk)_{(Articles I have written)} 02:32, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Please stay

I hope you do not even think about quitting as your work is sorely needed here on WN. 64.229.187.135 18:01, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

RfDA

If my contributions to Wikinews are repaid in the form of my Admin access being withdrawn, I will quit the project. In case the RfDA passes, I ask that my user and user-talk pages be deleted. Thank you. PVJ^(Talk)_{(Articles I have written)} 18:02, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

You have indeed made valuable contributions to Wikinews, and that cannot be ignored. However, you have done some incriminating things as an admin. While I do not wish for you to be an admin, I would really like it if you were still a contributor. —this is messedrocker (talk) 18:15, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

I am sorry, but if you want me contributing to Wikinews, then I will do so as an Administrator. If my actions were so unforgivable as to eclipse the fact that I write an article every day (even when involved in disputes), then maybe I should not be here. Although my statement might sound selfish, the community's trust is the "reward" that I believe I have earned by contributing here, and if that is gone, then I will have no incentive to go on writing. In the end it is up to the community to decide which course of action will be best for Wikinews. PVJ^(Talk)_{(Articles I have written)} 18:22, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

How about this as an incentive? If you happen to lose your adminship, but you regain the trust of the community, then you will be able to become an admin again. If you're not an admin, there is still a source of motivation: striving for the goal of being able to be an admin again. All it takes is working positively with the community. —this is messedrocker (talk) 18:36, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

• Your contributions are not at issue, and nobody is questioning their value. What is being questioned is your ability to keep your cool and stay within the self-imposed boundaries you must adhere to as an administrator. I have had two incidents where I have felt I needed to break the rules in such a way as to merit a block. I served my blocks, having felt no need to threaten to leave the project. Unblocking yourself is a pretty severe breach of the rules; just because the software lets you doesn't mean you should. --Brian McNeil / ^talk 20:51, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

I strongly suspect the software allows it merely to give admins enough rope to hang themselves. Nyarlathotep 02:27, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

To answer your question, the RfdA will be finished 28 October 2006, where it'll be determined whether you keep adminship or a steward will be requested to remove it. Remember, just because the RfdA finishes on the 28th, that doesn't mean your Wikinews career will end, too. You are a very valuable contributor to Wikinews, especially with your articles on India. —this is messedrocker (talk) 15:29, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

RfdAs are very uncommon, however if it's anything like the typical RFA, 75-80% consensus (depending on the weight of the arguments) is needed for your sysop privileges to be removed. Of course, you can always resign by going to m:Requests for permissions. —this is messedrocker (talk) 16:52, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Poll on cat Israel

I started a (non-binding) poll on the category just to see where everyone stood. I understand you cared a lot about that issue, but you are currently blocked. Would you like me to place a vote for you. Bawolff ☺☻ 19:08, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Block revoked

Since MR created an RfdA, I've revoked your block and voted support (conditional upon this specific block not being reimposed). Don't take it personally, I just feel RfdA is a better venue. Odds are you won't lose adminship via RfdA, even MrM never did. But continuing as you have been would eventually create an arbitration case which would easily take away your admin status. Nyarlathotep 02:59, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

some more gratuitous advice

#5 Wikinews is not a theatre of war. please do ur utmost to interact politely with other users. resist the temptation to indulge in personal attacks and from escalating conflicts, they will almost invariably be counter-productive. if u have a disagreement with a user that prevents you from constructively collaborating, consider Wikinews:Dispute resolution.  — Doldrums(talk) 16:30, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Help Editing Administrators Page

Why can only Administrators vote on the Administrators page? الموت على الاسلام 16:31, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

New users, and anonoymous users can't edit because of the horde of sockpuppets we get on that page every now and then. Bawolff ☺☻ 21:10, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Category:Terrorism

That's because someone (I think it was you) left me a message but forgot to write [[:Category:Terrorism]] without the colon, so the link was treated as a category. —this is messedrocker (talk) 19:30, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, I cannot remove votes, however I did remove the attack message in question. And please, don't leave Wikinews. The reason I called the RfdA is so you can spend time on Wikinews away from the stresses of adminship so that you can gain your privileges back later. —this is messedrocker (talk) 11:04, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

re:Just a thought

I think you set out to draw the sword on me, by putting up a parody of my USA bashing user-page section, after I voted to support your first RfDA. I previously told you that I don’t care much about talk page stuff. What I did not tell you was that I also don’t care much for stuff like whether you are, or are not, an administrator. I fail to see how that has any meaning for your involvement here.

Beyond that, I admire the strength of your convictions, and wish you well. I would venture to say that nobody here wants to see you leave, including me. This is supposed to be a world news source of which you are a part. I like reading news about what you find interesting in your part of the world. And if you are not too over-the-top, the counter-balance you can bring to USA-centric news reports.

I believe an RfDA is the starting point to address infractions. Ilya may regard requests placed there as a harassment to the individual listed, and distraction to the community. Maybe that is so, and if there was any merit to the RfDA, I take the opposite view that harassment and distraction must have occurred for it to have been brought there. Best regards -Edbrown05 07:21, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

RE: Hey

LOL...indeed it is my Birthday :) I am the big ld 26 which feels better than calling myself a "half century" old ;-)

P.S. I still have NOT seen the movie The Davinci Code, but have read the book and Dan Brown's other: Angels and Demons. Both are good books IMO. Jason Safoutin 22:43, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

you are involved in the case.

Please, PVJ59 , don't take any actions against Daniel575. Lets other admin take any action needed as you are involved into this case.

your writing about Israel was not acceptable as well Daniel575 about India.

We need urgently to stop that before other people come and burn wikinews to the ground.

Jacques Divol 07:02, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Leaving

It is sad that users have to use an Rfda as extortion to leave the project. It's sad, but I hope you decide to come back at some point. Jason Safoutin 20:18, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

I didn't want you to leave. Thunderhead(talk) 20:29, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

And I did. People who call for the 'destruction' and 'annihalation' of other countries are not the kind of people whom I want to see writing on any Wikimedia project (which readers trust because they think it is objective (well, that's the way it should be anyway)). People who express such viewpoints do not belong on any Wikimedia project. Of course, if PVJ apologizes for calling for the 'destruction' and 'annihalation' of my country and promises not to say such things again, I will be the firs to welcome him back on Wiki-anything. --Daniel575 19:26, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Ignore the trolling and come back

Hi PVJ, If you check the administrators page you'll see you've not been de-listed. As I understand it, MessedRocker tried to withdraw the RfdA after you made a number of comments conceding that there were valid points made by people. Why not come back and just lay off the admin powers for a while, use {{speedy}} and all the other non-admin notification methods... I sometimes use them myself just to get a second opinion. --Brian McNeil / ^talk 20:29, 26 October 2006 (UTC)