Talk:Swaziland's King Mswati III signs gazette to rename country to eSwatini

Perspective

Although the simplest ways to compromise news neutrality involve non-attribution, it's also possible to produce a non-neutral report by omitting information in a misleading way. It is somewhat striking, here, that basically everything in this article is about what the king did and said. A natural question to ask is, is there another side to this story that isn't appearing here? Admittedly, sometimes a very short report just doesn't get into nuances; but, raising the question. --Pi zero (talk) 14:21, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Gazette

Looking at the sources "gazette" does seem to be the word for some form of legal document in African nations. However, it is my belief that this is a non-standard usage for the majority of English speakers. As such, it should be defined early in the article. Frankly, I still don't know what gazette means (in this context), and I was was searching quite a bit on the internet. --SVTCobra 18:01, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Not only in African countries.
223.237.192.239 (talk) 18:05, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

That looks like a newspaper which is the standard use. It doesn't explain anything. Why are you unable to even explain what a 'gazette' is in this context? What is it? --SVTCobra 18:16, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Actually, it is official government document from on GoI's website. I don't see a reason to explain a simple English word; but you can always use a dictionary.
•–• 18:47, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, you don't think I already did that? Do you even read the things you link to? It says newspaper. --SVTCobra 19:03, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

No, I think you read only the part which helps your arguments. “the official journal published by the British government, and containing legal and state notices.” It is a word used in most of the British Commonwealth territories.
223.237.196.143 (talk) 19:07, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

And bullshit about the GoI link being law or legislation. It clearly says "weekly". It's just a newspaper published by the government. It's not law, even if it makes legal notifications. --SVTCobra 19:08, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

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Now, using your own words, please define "gazette" as it is used in this article. Stop posting irrelevant links. --SVTCobra 19:11, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Oh, so now it is a bullshit? You think you can get away with adding "Law or legislation" and then blame me for that? I fail to see how that has any problem with the article.
•–• 19:15, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

So you are admitting that you don't know what "gazette" means, even though you used it a bunch of times in the article. That is going to be fun review. --SVTCobra 19:17, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

For the avoidance of doubt, it's a government gazette, an official newspaper used for some but not all important state announcements. See for example the London Gazette used by the UK government, the former colonial ruler of Swaziland, and which was the template for many of the current official gazettes. For example, you may have heard of some unknown American actress who got married over the weekend to a minor royal at an old castle near London, in Ye Olde England. The Queen issued some coins so we might remember who they are - here’s the digital page in the Gazette, which means it really was an announcement by the Queen. It's pretty much the same way the US does it, through the Federal Register, at least until President Trump came along with his tweets. Green Giant (talk) 19:19, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Feel free whatever you want to assume, naja.
223.237.193.119 (talk) 19:22, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Surely, the common goal here is to produce an article that can be readily understood as widely as possible. A USian, using a term that might be misunderstood by some readers, might do well to provide a bit of explanation at first instance. The same applies to other terms used in other places that might not be universally understood. It can sometimes be quite difficult to explain terms, of course, as some people don't understand the term while other people don't see what needs explanation. Thanks to Green Giant for helping out with this. --Pi zero (talk) 19:34, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Again, Green G, it's a newspaper whether it is published by the government or not. What does signing a newspaper do or mean? The usage in this article is absolute baffling to me. --SVTCobra 19:35, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Yes, it is a government newspaper but not a general newspaper in the same sense as the NY Times. It is just a medium for the King (and the government) to formally announce important decisions. For example, one of the sources in the article is the Swaziland Times. If people read that article, some might believe the name has been changed but others might doubt it. However, if people read it in the official government newspaper, it removes any doubt about whether the King really did change the country name. Like I noted above, when the US President signs a presidential order or proclamation, we might see it on the TV news, with Pres. Trump holding it up. However, that same order will then be published in the Federal Register as a formal notification. I’m not sure if that makes sense to you but it’s no different to how many organisations might make an official announcement of the appointment of a new CEO by putting a notice on their website.

The Swaziland Gazette itself doesn’t seem to have a website but there is this transcript of the King’s speech when he signed the announcement - see the lower half of page 16. The only problems are it is undated and I found it through the third article on gov.sz. Green Giant (talk) 20:11, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

I realise it is an absolute monarchy. But don't monarchs also put things into official law or a statute? This newspaper/gazette issue must look confusing to more than just me, even if I am an American snake. --SVTCobra 20:18, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

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Gazette is something most of the [formerly or still] monarch countries would have -- it is still in use in so many countries -- some news media (Italian ones) mention "Gazetta" in their name even if not regulated by the government. Canada (another one under GBR) has Gazette -- I guess the US is the odd one out.
•–• 20:24, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Come on, Acagastya. There are tons of US newspapers with "Gazette" in their names. Of the ones you mentioned, do any of them carry the force of law? I don't think so. If Justin Trudeau signed whatever Canadian Gazette you are referring to, it would mean absolutely nothing. Is this protracted discussion really better than just fixing the article so people can understand it? What is the concept you are trying to defend? --SVTCobra 20:33, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

I see your point SVTCobra. The word Gazette is not restricted to government use in these countries as far as I’m aware but "The Swaziland Government Gazette" is the only one with the word "government" in its name. There may be other gazettes in Swaziland and neighbouring countries but this is the only official Swazi government mouthpiece. Green Giant (talk) 22:16, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

Review of revision 4407666 [Passed]

Revision 4407666 of this article has been reviewed by Pi zero (talk · contribs) and has passed its review at 23:23, 20 May 2018 (UTC). Copyright: Passed Newsworthiness: Passed Verifiability: Passed NPOV: Passed Style: Passed Comments by reviewer: None added. The reviewed revision should automatically have been edited by removing {{Review}} and adding {{Publish}} at the bottom, and the edit sighted; if this did not happen, it may be done manually by a reviewer.

Revision 4407666 of this article has been reviewed by Pi zero (talk · contribs) and has passed its review at 23:23, 20 May 2018 (UTC). Copyright: Passed Newsworthiness: Passed Verifiability: Passed NPOV: Passed Style: Passed Comments by reviewer: None added. The reviewed revision should automatically have been edited by removing {{Review}} and adding {{Publish}} at the bottom, and the edit sighted; if this did not happen, it may be done manually by a reviewer.