User talk:Watti Renew

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tempodivalse 13:41, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Changes to archived articles[edit]

Hi, if you need an archived or protected article changed - use {{editprotected}} on the relevant talk page. Thanks! --Brian McNeil / talk 15:45, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks Brian McNeil, as my request is completed, could you please remove the comment on page Italian court overturns law preventing trial of Prime Minister Berlusconi? Watti Renew (talk) 16:24, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
We don't generally remove them - a history of requested changes. Is there any particular reason you'd like it removed? --Brian McNeil / talk 16:27, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
Ok. After correction, the note is unnecessary, but the general custom is ok for me. I add the template next time. Thanks! Watti Renew (talk) 16:40, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Peat energy war in Finland[edit]

In its current form, this article isn't "news" according to our definition, as I have explained in more detail on the article's talk page.

When and if you believe it is suitable for publication, you will need to put a {{review}} tag on it to request that it be peer reviewed by an authorized reviewer. --Pi zero (talk) 20:55, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

This was my my first article in Wikinews: Peat energy war in Finland [1]. In my opinion speedy deletion was not neutral since it benefits commercial interests. Further, there are no evidence of the deletion criteria available as the talk page do not excist. Watti Renew (talk) 18:32, 26 January 2011 (UTC)
The deletion was completely neutral, as it was based on criteria that are applied to all articles on this project, regardless of topic. The public log of the deletion is here.
The peer review by BRS on 22 January failed it on newsworthiness because it was stale, and failed it on style because it was "Written as an encyclopedic piece." There was also this exchange between you and me on the 22nd:
In my opinion this news fits Wikinews better than Wikipedia since it describes more in detail one major conflict connected with one political decision. In my opinion this article should take place here, since it describes an essential conflict in Finland’s national energy policy and human rights and has important connections to the international environmental and political concerns of peat. In order to understand the conflict better, I may need to include more background information about the peat. Wikipedia:Ignore all rules: If a rule prevents you from improving or maintaining Wikipedia, ignore it. This should apply also here. I think we should use common sense and not love the rules. Watti Renew (talk) 13:39, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
Wikinews is not Wikipedia. Note especially, on that page, items 6 and 9. Wikinews and Wikipedia are independent sister projects under the aegis of the Wikimedia Foundation (so that, incidentally, a Wikipedia guideline such as w:WP:IAR doesn't apply to Wikinews, any more than our guidelines apply to Wikipedia). Wikinews publishes articles about events that have just happened. --Pi zero (talk) 14:20, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
--Pi zero (talk) 19:29, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

A few tips on getting oriented to Wikinews[edit]

Watti Renew,

I noticed you were having a difficult time getting adjusted to Wikinews. It's a different project than Wikipedia, although many Wikipedians migrate over to the news side here. Both share a NPOV mindset. So you're bringing something to this sister project just by being here. My advice for fitting in would be to think about how the form and culture are different from what you are used to. Don't worry, such disorientation is normal.

The news form has something in common with the encyclopedia form in that the significance goes up top. But the news lead is typically current and focuses on giving the most relevant answer to the questions who, what, where, when, why, and how (much). Several structures are common. The most common is the pyramid whereby you would put the most important information after the lead and follow through to least. Another popular stucture in time-oriented articles is the chronological structure where you present the story in order of occurance. Issue oriented stories are generally presented in blocks of ideas. News articles are not as indepth as encyclopedia articles. Be as current as possible and link to the relevant background. You only need as much background in a news article as a reader needs in order to make sense of the focus and details. These are just a few tips. You'll find that writing news is creative and helps keep you engaged with what is going on the world.

The culture: Wikinews has a hierarchy that is quite standard in journalism. There's the writer and the editor. It's a relationship where the writer tries to write and report to the highest quality and the editor helps the writer until the writer is able to achieve more. If I had to compare to Wikipedia, I would point you to the relationship between the article creator and the editors at AFC. One more point: Wikipedia emphasizes it is not news. And Wikinews emphasizes it is not an encyclopedia. So there are good reasons why there are differences in the process.

To start off, select an event within the past few hours, find two sources for now, read them, sit back and reflect on what is important, use one of the structures above, and write it out. Ask another writer for feedback. Watch your article closely during this period as you'll most likely have to revise based on suggestions and resubmit. Address every issue. The editor will always work in good faith; it's the standard. The editor is your best friend, and so work with this person and others to revise all issues.

I hope this makes sense and that you'll decide to stay and try it out the news way! Good luck to you and all the best from a fellow Wikimedia volunteer, Crtew (talk) 15:59, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks Crtew. I exist and have good will but am in a hurry. Come back. Thanks. Watti Renew (talk) 12:13, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

Finnish court gives MP Ilkka Kanerva suspended prison sentence[edit]

Hi. There were some issues that need resolving, so the article was not ready on review. See the review comments, and detailed history of edits during review. --Pi zero (talk) 20:25, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Environmental expert article[edit]

You tried hard on that one!! Good show!! When you're having problems getting an article through the review process, I've had success by taking an axe to the article's contents!! Shorten that one up......facts, facts, facts! "Inverted pyramid".....the big, critical stuff in the first paragraph (about 4 sentences should do it), then a little back story, then a touch of "fluff".....then, you're done!! Keep at it! Need help? Just ask. Bddpaux (talk) 02:07, 1 May 2012 (UTC)


I'm actually genuinely sorry to have upset you. I'm not at my best right now for several reasons (primarily the one noted at the top of my talk), and I have found it really frustrating when you keep ignoring what is intended as useful advice. It's also frustrating to see you waste lots of time making large-scale additions that don't solve the problem at hand, and then waste our time too. So you've upset me too. Two upset people, not good.

What I want to propose is this. Take a break. As much time as you need. Tinker elsewhere on WMF if that's all you have time for. But, when you have quite a bit of time to spare - significant amounts of a day for two-three days - come back. We'll pick a story and we'll work on it together. A new, completely fresh story. We'll try and keep it simple to start off with, half the problem I think is you're keen to do very ambitious articles but don't have the time required to complete them before it's far too late. English sources only (because, sadly, that's the reality of the current set of reviewers we have), and not absolutely massive. Something about the length of what we've been publishing the last few days; still worthwhile to readers, but more... manageable.

Then lets see if we can produce something constructive out of all this. Blood Red Sandman (Talk) (Contribs) 22:39, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

I understand we are both frustrated. Sorry. I have been looking for more than an hour more English sources for Critics of Danish Security and Intelligence Service, but the point is that this is ignored in the nglish media. Here one: Espionage trial of Finnish professor starts in Denmark 9.5.2012. I try to write this in English Wikinews as you have no access to this news in English. If you have not access, I can not publish it? It does not make sense. For me it is important to link this peace of news Russians arrested environmental expert Knuuttila in Russia, since both may have link to the Arctic methane and climate change. Watti Renew (talk) 17:55, 11 May 2012 (UTC)