Wikinews:Water cooler/assistance/Archive/9

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[edit] Interviewing the illustrious "Jimbo" Wales

It has been brought to my attention that an interview of the Wikimedia founder, Jimbo Wales, is scheduled for the 5th of December. The topics suggested for the interview are the Wikinews project of the Wikimedia Foundation, and the upcoming Wikimedia Foundation fund drive. This will not just be of interest to Wikinewsies (where I would hope it can generate an article), but other news organisations will probably be interested in the material as they may not be so readily able to get material on Wiki projects as we can.

Of course, the thing is what sort of interesting — and thought-provoking — questions would people like to see put to the project founder? This is an open call for questions, which the interviewers (Kim Bruning and Mats Halldin) will comb through for material.

The one I'd like to propose as an opener is, "Do you believe that Wikinews, or any of the Wiki projects qualify as a meritocracy?" Brian McNeil / talk 21:20, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Jimbo Interview: Technical

I have noticed on Amgine's talk page that there is a discussion about how to get a conference call together and record this all for further processing. I suggest the service called freeconference.com -- it's free to use. If you want to do recording it can cost a bit of money (you have to do toll-free with that service to do recording), and if nobody wants to pay then there are probably other options that are cheaper. -- IlyaHaykinson 21:34, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome, The water cooler is cool. My first try using it. How do I get the cool box to stay on my page that was there before I started editing it but went away after the initial edit; it's the default for a blank; Can't find it, to determine what template it uses... Elvey 02:59, 2 February 2006 (UTC) DONE - it's there, in orange now.)

This comes from a MediaWiki: namespace article. It's used when pages are not found on Wikinews. I will get the name for the exact page in a minute. - Amgine | talk en.WN 03:12, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
The correct MediaWiki article is MediaWiki:Noarticletext - Amgine | talk en.WN 03:15, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
Thanks! - A happy camper.

[edit] Articles on Swaziland

I think the articles on our country, Swaziland, ruled by King Mswati the 3rd are just PLAIN RIDICULOUS, you guys need to get your facts straight or dont write anything at all about our beautiful country and its citizens, which includes our King and of course our beautiful culture which you CLEARLY haven't the slightest idea what its all about. I dont necessarily think my King and or country is perfect but hey "which country or ruler is perfect?" GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT PLEASE, if u need assistance understanding us as a people i will gladly help explain certain things e.g our culture and cultural activities in general. Thank You Shilabantu

Thanks for your comments. Wikinews articles are written by people just like you! You might consider writing for Wikinews -- the community is always pleased to have local contributors. --Chiacomo (talk) 03:52, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
Do you have any specific complaints about the article in question? (Category:Swaziland) Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 20:18, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] please take a look

I have rewritten and retitled the article now called Presidential signing statements and the Bush white house (formerly titled Bush says oversight rules are not binding) it is currently in the development area. I have two questions: how to i get it reviewed? and two when i retitled it asked about double links i belive there could be some but was unsure of what to do about it. Thanks Isles 21:28, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Question about merging

Is there an instruction page concerning the processes/protocols for merging articles. I am new to Wikinews (though I am an active editor on Wikipedia). I created and published an article today that was later tagged with a {{merge}} to an existing article in development. I brought over information from the existing article and removed the merge tag from the article I created. What is the proper process? Is it different if both articles are under development versus the case when one is published and the other is under development?

Thanks in advance. —ERcheck @ 22:40, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

hmm, I'm not really sure. We do not however update published articles. If they're both in develop, combine details, and {{delete}} one. Just do what makes sense. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 22:48, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
  • If I understand correctly, "breaking news" articles are the exception. Though unlike creating an article in Wikipedia, then in Wikinews, an article is not {{publish}}ed until it is complete and no further edits are required? —ERcheck @ 23:01, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
Pretty much. Occasionally they are unpublished and edited some more, but this is only if there is major issues on it. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 23:20, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missing Link

The link to the Wikinews style guide's gone missing from most of the pages where it used to be. Can anyone track just when it disappeared and roll back that change or edit a compromise that will keep the link available?

It's got deleted from Mediawiki:Sitenotice. see WN:SG. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 00:36, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for finding the page! I fixed it. Karen 19:23, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Someone keeps breaking it. I fixed it again. Karen 21:53, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
Dan100's been rverting you. You may wish to discuss it with him. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 22:30, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I thought I was reverting his edits.

His objection to the link is that "Style guide just doesn't seem to fit in - other links are all community ones." He considered it to be a tidy, after Article collaboration was added - as if the links listed must have something in commom to be listed near each other. I'm not sure what that has to do with it - my concern is that the link to the Style guide should persist until relocated to appear on Editing Wikinews: pages only, or in the toolbox list on the lower left. In other words, my objection is that it shouldn't be removed until added elsewhere. If that's not practical, then I don't see any valid reason why it can't remain where it has been since I began reading Wikinews. I will agree that it's not the optimal place for it, but I disagree about removing it before a better place is found. Karen 15:42, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

I kind of understand his point -- why dont' we link WN:CG as well? --Chiacomo (talk) 15:49, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

I've given it more thought and still don't understand why adding one and taking another away because it's not a feedback/discussion page even though it's been there for months is such a good idea. It took me awhile to find the style guide again because I was used to using the link. To help resolve this (as I said, I've given it a bit more thought), I'm not adverse to removing the Style guide link and replacing it with a link to the Content guide. After all, the Content guide has a link to the Style guide. Karen 18:20, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

However most people do know what a news article is, (or something similiar). Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 23:20, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AP copyright footer

The current copyright footer of all Associated Press news items reads "© 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed". The definition of 'rewritten' is very broad, and I wonder what people's interpretation of this copyright statement is.

Does this mean that by sourcing information from an Associated Press news item, and using this information as the basis for the creation of a wikinews item, that the author is in breach of Associated Press copyright ?

Can they legally stop people from re-writing it? Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 17:08, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
The notice is not entirely without merit. While facts like "Car bomb in Baghdad; 20 injured" are uncopyrightable information there is a doctrine called Misappropriation, established in a U.S. Supreme Court case of 1918, prohibiting news organsations from "stealing" news from their competitors. So while I don't think we're not breaching their copyright we might be engaging in unfair competition if we write our article to close to the source. So IMO we have to insert as much originality in our articles as possible, do own research, reach own conclusions (as far as permitted by WN:NPOV) etc. --Deprifry|+T+ 18:02, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Can I add an image to my signature?

I want to add the image of a Flag of India (25 px size) to my signature.Can I do this or is the image a fair-use one?I'm a very new user here so I'm not too sure.Please clarify.PVJ59 08:39, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Image:Flag_of_India.svg is in the public domain. You can use it without problems. --Deprifry|+T+ 10:48, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Where do I post a copy of copyright permission?

I recently requested Indian news website ibnlive.com to allow Wikinews to publish copyrighted text belonging to ibnlive.com on the former.The permission was granted subject to the condition that we cite cnnibn.com.I have a copy of the e-mail indicating cnnibn's agreement to this request on my talkpage[1] (because I didn't know where else to put it).Which is the correct page to list copyright permissions.PVJ 12:37, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Good question. You could create a page Wikinews:Agreement with ibnlive.com, and link every article that used stuff with it via:
This article was originally imported from ibnlive.com — Family SOS Australian expert, which is licensed under the with ibnlive.com agreement we have with ibnlive.com licensure and is compatible with Wikinews' license.

Or something similiar. See Category:Citation_templates for ideas. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 22:43, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Nowhere, "with permission" is not compatible with the GFDL. Ed g2s 17:31, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
  1. yes it sort of is, if its permission to use under the terms of GFDL (Or at least thats my impression as I see with permission notices throughout 'pedia, and don't understand why it shouldn't be)
  2. WE are CC-BY not GFDL. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 02:39, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Advice requested

I have started an article Wikinews interviews Ethan Zuckerman for the last IOTM we held last month, but I am not 100% sure how to go about writing the article from the interview :) And advice/help? Brian | (Talk) | New Zealand Portal 09:33, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] How to use source template

I appreciate and applaud the need for sources to be referenced in a consistent way but what happens if the publisher doesn't have a Wikipedia entry? I'll tell you what happens (:-p), a link to a non existent page. For example, say one of my sources is an article from silicon.com, if I use do this:

*{{source|url=http://www.silicon.com/research/specialreports/idcards/0,3800010140,39158816,00.htm|title=ID cards will be 'cloned within six months'|author=Steve Ranger|pub=silicon.com|date=May 10, 2006}}

You get:

If you click on silicon.com you get a Wikipedia 'start this article' page. Is there any way to divert it somewhere else? This may be a stupid question, in which case I apologise. WillJenkins 19:01, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

That's because Silicon.com isn't the publisher, CNET is (search for silicon.com on that page). With some sites you need to google within wikipedia to find out who the publisher is.

Source should be thus:

Or you could create silicon.com on Wikipedia and redirect it to the CNET article. --Brian McNeil / talk 19:16, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Why is the lack of wikipedia article horrible. I don't like it, but I don't think it matters too much. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 02:41, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Copyright on Images

What's the process if we believe an image shouldn't be being used due to copyright? I refer to Image:IAFIL-76.jpg. I've put some comments on the Talk page but will anyone pick this up? (I took a look at whether to use a copyvio tag but this appeared to be more geared towards articles?) (And on a side note how do I make a link to an Image page?) R2b2 02:53, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

TO link an image, put a leading :. I will look into the image, Generally, since we don't gwt to many image problems here, general thing to do is to tell admins, or list it on dr. If its at commons you're supposed to tag it. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 03:44, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
Thanks - will use that process if i come across anything again... R2b2 04:44, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Review

Could a few of you review "12 arrested in Canadian counter-terrorism operation"" and Comment/wikify it. Thanks MyName 16:01, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] You have new messages

When viewing a user's page who has a message, the notice "You have new messages (last change)" appears. I don't recall ever seeing that behaviour before, but it's confusing. Please forward this bug report to someone who can fix such things. Karen 17:10, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

Bug? I think not! Someone decided to take the code for the box and impose it on their page. —THIS IS MESSEDImage:R with umlaut.pngOCKER (TALK) 17:11, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
This is a prank, an old joke on en.wikipedia. The easiest way to see the difference is to check whether the "You have a new message" bar is above the page title. If so, it's real. If not, it is a prank placed inside the page you're viewing. - Amgine 17:13, 11 June 2006 (UTC)~ (editing not logged in)
Oh, like when you page someone over the intercom to have them call you at their own extension, which leads them to their own voice mail. I've another small issue that I'll post below. Karen 17:20, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
Oh yeah, the new message thing is a great source of annoyance (: Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 18:04, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Slight vertical whitespace difference

While trying to make each story appear in a consistent manner, I've seen a slight vertical whitespace difference in stories for no reason. Compare the distance between the date and the copy in Fernando Alonso wins British Grand Prix versus New Hawaii airline sparks fare war, free seat giveaway for an example. Karen 17:20, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

One starts with a link and one doesn't. If you look at the source, you see that one has an extra <p>. I don't know why this happens Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 17:57, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
adding before first link:
<span style="speak: none;display:none;"> </span>

or

<span style="speak: none;display:none;"> </span>
Should do the trick. However this is a work around to a problem that shouldn't be there. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 18:02, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

A paragraph tag usually moves down 1 1/2 line spaces, while a line break tag just moves down 1. I think it looks better with the 1 1/2 spacing, but that would require an ending paragraph tag somewhere. The ending of a line break tag is within the same tag that begins it: <br /> Karen 19:01, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

I was under the impression you shouldn't use p's if its not a paragraph. Shouldn't this be handaled in Mediawiki:common.css? The point is that if the story starts with a link, it doesn't insert a leading paragraph tag, but if it starts with plain text it does insert leading paragraph. To me this is something that should not happen, that is a problem with the way wikicode is phrased. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 20:56, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

If you place a space between the date template and the copy, the whitespace will be only one line, but if you place no space, but include a new line, the whitespace will be 1 1/2 spaces. It could be a problem with the wikicode - the interpretation is that a space is turned into a new line tag, but a new line with another new line in between is a new paragraph. Maybe there's a way to edit the story so that it's always consistent. I'll try to fix a few of the 1-line whitespace stories to see how it can be done. Karen 21:10, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

I noticed your fix worked in the story Fernando Alonso wins British Grand Prix (even though it looks messy). That must be it - when a story with a date template is proceeded immediately by Wikipedia link, the vertical whitespace is only 1 line. From all my ramblings, it's probably clear that I'm not sure where the problem is at all. Thanks for the help - at least I know I'm not just seeing things. Karen 21:15, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

The problem is with mediawiki I think, not with us. Yeah it looks messy, however its hidden by css. On a browser that doesn't support css ther'd be a slight indentation like this:

 blah blah foo bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..bar baz fred joe bob xxyz insert text here..

Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 21:58, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Absurd stories in development

etc. Is this list going to continue to grow? Is there a better way to prevent stories of X found in Y from being created? Karen 23:37, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

I wouldn't think so. Wikipedia has the exact same type of issues. One of the pains of being an admin I suppose is dealing with these =) -- Ash Lux (talk | contribs) 02:27, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Why not just publish empty stories, so they won't show as being in perpetual development? Karen 02:40, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Hmm.. yah, that's definately something that needs to be fixed. It is kind of embarassing to have such an obsured thing shown on the front page as being "in development". We might want a new cat for these type of stuff and modify our dynamic page lists to include notcategory=Protected, not to be recreated. Might be a better solution than marking them as published. -- Ash Lux (talk | contribs) 02:51, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
Now that I look at it, these articles are in Category:No publish. Might want to add that to the dynamic page lists. Especially on the front page and on Wikinews:Workspace -- Ash Lux (talk | contribs) 02:52, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
Let me follow up myself yet again and point out Category:Protected deletions too. -- Ash Lux (talk | contribs) 02:54, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

{{nopublish}} works to add the category... --Chiacomo (talk) 02:54, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

I think I'm cracking up! I'll get some sleep and try not to dream I saw these strange stories in development. Karen 03:06, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you also shouldn't dream about : "Canadians donating money to pay off government debt" and "Nude bicyclists in Mexico City". Nyarlathotep 13:55, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] World cup stories

I have to say I love these stories - great coverage overall, and all the games being hit. That being said, pretty much every one has a grammar issue in the title - normally an issue with a missing "s". How are these getting published with something so obvious getting through? It basically seems like no copyediting is being done on these articles at all. I've been gone for awhile. Have I missed something? Lyellin 02:15, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dedicating a week to writing news

Hi all,

As you may have seen on my user space, I've taken a week off to spend on Wikinews, as a bit of an experiment to see what can be achived when you have some time on your hands. I'm working with BBC News online - they're giving me a desk to work from and access to stuff we don't normally get like news wires and other resources, whilst I'm doing a bit of writing for them about my experiences. There should be a bit of coverage of it on their site, which will be good for Wikinews.

I'd quite like some assistance in finding stories and figuring out what to cover. I'm willing to travel around London, phone people up, and generally see what I can do to help generate some good open-source news output. If you have any ideas - please leave them on my user space.

Cheers,

Frankie Roberto 21:43, 19 June 2006 (UTC) (Admin, accredited Wikinewsie)

Wow, that is very cool. I greatly admire the BBC and their news work, and it is very generous of them to give you their resources! I will look forward to your writing. I, personally, hope to some day work for a news organization like the BBC. ~ clearthought 17:50, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
This is all finished now - you check what happened here here and here Frankie Roberto 18:10, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Very well written and interesting! ~ clearthought 20:05, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Protected Special: edit request

Can someone (I'm assuming an Administrator), edit Special:Captcha/help to include a note that it requires cookies to be enabled? For someone behind a firewall or other autoblocking system, repeatedly attempting to save a page with URIs in it could rapidly become infuriating. 68.39.174.238 20:22, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm an admin, I can't edit this, I think it is a more special than usual "special" page. :-) --Brian McNeil / talk 21:05, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
It can probably be found on Special:Allmessages, if you can find the right one any admin can edit it. --Cspurrier 21:16, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hoax??

143-year-old man turns 144 today - can someone look into this?? --Sozzaboy 22:52, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

It is undoubtedly a hoax. The oldest living man is 114 years old [2], which is thirty years younger than the 144 man in question. Additionally, the oldest man in the United Kingdom, where this "144 year old man" comes from, is Henry Allingham and not Tom Biddigan. Additionally, googling for "Tom Biddigan" returns zero results. Is that enough evidence? —this is messedr͏̈ocker (talk) 23:36, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Newsworthy?: MS ends XP SP1 support

Hi there,

Yesterday, a news article about Microsoft ending support for Windows 98 and Me popped up here (and on BBC too), and I expanded and published it, as my first contribution to Wikinews.

I found this one newsworthy, but maybe that's because "70 million will be affected by the change"...

In October, Microsoft will end support for Windows XP SP1 (Service Pack 1) and SP1a. Is this as newsworthy as the Win98 story? I'm not sure. If yes, I'll make a prepared story for it. If not, I'll leave it.

What are your opinions? --Szajd 11:45, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

(Note: The story is now under preparation. See User_talk:Szajd and Wikinews:Story preparation/Microsoft ends support for Windows XP's first service pack Tomos 10:27, 30 July 2006 (UTC)).

[edit] Portal:Prepared stories VS. Wikinews:Story preparation

Hi,

I'm fairly new to Wikinews. I was trying to clean the things on Wikinews:Story preparation, and moved back to prepared obituaries to this namespace, when I realised, that there is a Portal:Prepared stories, which isn't linked from anywhere, but is used, and is not in sync with WN:SP.

This is totally-totally bad, unusable, unfriendly.

I'd suggest to merge the whole thing to the portal page, but this needs to be dealt with. --Szajd 12:44, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Hmm, good point. I'm not sure what the solution is right now, will think it over some more... Frankie Roberto 22:30, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] help with copyright stuff

this map[3] might be useful in articles about the current israel-lebanon conflict. can someone verify its copyright status and whether we can use it (can we convert it to some image format and use it?).

the map does not appear to have any copyright tag. it is hosted on the UNIFIL website[4] which has a "© United Nations 2005" notice. Doldrums 11:56, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Assistance with another copyright enquiry

Can someone who knows CC-BY inside out check out Talk:Ohio's Nick & Jimmy's Bar and Grill investigated after dozens become ill. Given the copyright for the Food Safety Network, I don't believe it fits in with a CC-BY licence but I'm wanting confirmation from a "guru" --R2b2 22:36, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

(I responded on talk, and proceeded for request for deletion. Tomos 10:28, 30 July 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Some edits and some new pages...

I've been making use of the fact that IPs can create pages here to import a favorite guideline/policy from WpA, WN:HOAX. I've tried to make it more Wikinews specific, and would like other people's input. Also, I did some work on Wikinews:Protected deletions. Before I progress, I'd appreciate other eyes checking this stuff and making sure that any future work wont have to be cleaned up (Although I hope it's not that bad ;D). Thanx. 68.39.174.238 20:27, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Only thing is, I don't think we do corrections - except to articles that have been published for a day or more.
In addition, if you are a Wikipedia user and create an account here with the same email address (not sure if the username needs to be the same but would be better to assume so) then the eventual change to a single-signon will merge the accounts. And there are some things IPs can't do - like renames. --Brian McNeil / talk 20:33, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Brainmc, 68.39.174.238 is not one for the creation of a username ;) MyName 20:39, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I saw that on his talk page after I'd made the comment. I remember pseudonyms better than numbers, so I'll just assume it is a tactic to avoid getting asked to mediate on anything. :) --Brian McNeil / talk 20:42, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I have alot of reasons depending on the situation, however I'm not trying to shirk out of something. Anyway, I was unaware of {{correction}} when I wrote that, hence the initiall omission. 68.39.174.238 22:28, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Man confesses to 1996 murder of JonBenet Ramsey

New information, as posted by Wikipedia contributor, seems to be new, sound lead. -- Zanimum 15:45, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Total Newbie Questions

1. For my first entry I received permission from a site to publish a re-written copy of a news item they carried on Google - When it was flagged for copyright suspicion, I had the copyright owner enter his permission on the talk page as instructed.

It is still in the copyright suspicion mode - is there something further that I need to do now?

For instance - publish again?

http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Google_Ranked_First_in_e-Business_Customer_Satisfaction

Story link above

2. I wrote a complete news item from scratch for my second entry - It was put back into development becuase it "clearly needs more work". What exactly does that mean?

I just deleted the "offending" paragraph and re-published. Is this what is supposed to happen?

http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Web.com_Announces_Second_Quarter_Results

Story link above

Answers:
  1. . wikinews needs to be certain that it is the original copyright holder who "gave permission" on the talk page. ways to do that are:
    1. change the copyright license on the original site to a wikinews news compatible one.
    2. if the original site content's author is identified, then the author can send a verifiable message to a wikinews administrator granting permission (for instance, send a mail from the author's e-mail address listed on the original site)
  2. the rewritten article still has large chunks of text taken verbatim from the original source, and therefore remains a copyright violation. (oops, my mistake! Doldrums 10:37, 19 August 2006 (UTC))
  3. No. what is supposed to happen, is for the article to be rewritten, preferably drawing information from a number of sources and written in the words of the wikinews editor (i.e. not being substantially identical to the text of the sources).
hope this helps. Doldrums 10:24, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
By the way, emails can be faked, but I believe that an email is good enough. Preferablly sent to [wikinews-l] mailing list: mailto:wikinews-l@wikimedia.org (I believe) Sorry if this sounds suspicious, we just have to make sure. 04:39, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Now I am TOTALLY Confused

So I am a NEW writer for Wikinews.

Trying to be a GOOD citizen and contribute a story in my area of expertise (web hosting/domains/webmaster). The piece is:

Totally orginal writing;

Well documented with orginal source material;

Covers a well-known company which is the ONLY publicly held web hosting company in the US;

Properly formatted and submitted for publication;

Has a neutral POV (as I understand it);

Submitted in the proper category.

So here is the opinion of the Wikinews editorial team (quoted from Talk page):


"Who the fuck is Web.com? I've never heard of them. If this is their second quarter results then they've been public for six months. Woopdee-doo. Over on Wikipedia we'd say this was "not notable". Lets just delete this attempt at using Wikinews for free publicity. --Imroy 13:54, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

I've never heard of Web.com either. FellowWikiNews (W) 14:01, 19 August 2006 (UTC) So it appears that they're patent trolls and spammers? Won't someone delete this drivel? Leif 18:05, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

This "news article" reads like a press release. It's also POV."

Retrieved from "http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Talk:Web.com_announces_second_quarter_results"


So in my opinion this looks like a TOTAL FLAME for someone who is honestly trying to report on a REAL news story. Here is what the above comments lead me to believe:

1. If you aren't born an expert in Wikinews and its policies, don't bother. We'll curse at you for trying.

2. If anyone at Wikinews editorial hasn't heard of the company (isn't that the case at some point for EVERY company) then it isn't newsworthy. So where exactly is the list of companies that qualify as "notable"?

3. Niche markets/companies are not newsworthy - only MAJOR events that get reported by dozens and dozens of new outlets. Wikinews is only a "me too" news organization.

4. Companies that license patents are considered "patent trolls" by Wikinews and should not be covered. If they are, we'll take a personal shot at the writer by labeling it "drivel".

Are the comments posted above merely "constructive criticism" and to be naturally expected - or am I really not welcome at Wikinews?

Should I continue to contribute the type of news item that I submitted or is Wikinews simply not interested in the web hosting/domain/webmaster news niche?

Please help me out with this. Thank you in advance for any insight.

u r right in that the comments are "flame"-like and do not help in improving the article (except the last one, which does try to point out possible problems with the article). note that the "Wikinews editorial team" is really anyone who came upon the site and decided to leave a comment - wikinews employs an open editing process.
now what is important is this the article itself has been published - it is the consensus opinion of wikinews contributors that the article is newsworthy and written well enough to be published. and i think u should pat urself on the back for publishing ur first article.
points 1 to 4 above do not represent wikinews guidelines, Wikinews:Content guide and Wikinews:What Wikinews is not do.
as u mentioned, NPOV is not easy to achieve, and another look at Wikinews:NPOV and Wikipedia:NPOV never hurts.
if u are troubled by such comments, u can ignore them, or attempt to engage the commentors in a discussion, point out that you find the comments offensive and importantly, refrain from acting in the same way urself. point out that such comments can fall foul of Qikinews:Etiquette guidelines (making sure that u follow them urself). if that does not help, u can bring it to the attention of administrators, who can intervene if necessary.
again, congrats on publishing the first article, i look forward to more from u. Doldrums 11:47, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
I'm sorry that you had such a rough begining, I hope it will get better, and you are definitly welcome here. The important thing to remember is always to stay polite when things like that happen, which you did. Wikinews is sometimes used to increase the publicity of unknown companys, and sometimes that gets confused with actual articles. People are often suspicious of new users who publish articles on unknown topics because that is where the majority of spam comes from (which we really shouldn't be, but its hard to fight spam sometimes). the comments on that talk page are a little too much critisim and not enough constructive in my personal opinion, but remember there are many voices on wikinews, and they don't represent the majority, as well as the intent/emotion behind most comments on the internet are usually misinterpeted [5] . I really hope you decide to stay, as lots of people in your place would have been very rude and disruptive about it, where you calmly presented your complaints in a polite fashion, that is a very good trait. If you need any assitance, don't hessitate to ask me or anyone else (or post it here). Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 05:04, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Adding categories to archived articles

Hi there. I don't post too much here but I thought about trying to recategorize some old articles and I realized that editing archived articles was not always possible. I was wondering if there was an easy way to do it that wouldn't require some admin going through and essentially just duplicating the work I was going to do in the first place? (The only solution I see at the moment is to double the effort, which seems silly.)

Basically I want to create a category for nuclear power (power plants, reactors, etc.), another for nuclear weapons (only for things explicitly relating to actual nuclear weapons, not alleged proliferation, which has its own category which could be a sub-category). It seems like a sensible arrangement since there are a few hundred articles that would fall under each category that are currently not categorized in any way that would lump them together.

Thoughts, suggestions? I sometimes enjoy categorizing things which I know about (i.e. I did all of the nuclear weapons categorization at Commons), because it is usually very easy for me to spot what goes into what category without any ambiguity. I'm willing to do the work, I just want to know if there's a way to do it without needing someone else to do it twice. --Fastfission 16:48, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

hmm, Sorry but its our policy to protect archived articles (anti-spam mostly). If you list the articles on WN:ALERT or on my talk page I could make sure that they become categorized, but that is duplicating efforts :(. Another option maybe is make a bot that would give you (and possiblly others) the ability to categorize protected pages without giving other admin privlideges, but that is beyond my capabilities. (I don't have the technical knowladge to build bots). Sorry. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 04:35, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] cats running wild on wikinews

i think categories are need of an overhaul. there's a list of cats, which i think, need attention (or deletion). would appreciate any assistence with/suggestions on dealing with them. i hope to eventually have a comprehensive, if not complete, category tree so that editors can quickly see if suitable categories exist for articles they're writing. Doldrums 06:01, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Agh! not another war on categories!! its like the war on terror and drugs, you're not going to win :D (For people lacking a sense of humour, don't take that last sentence literally). I myself bvelieve that in general categories are a good thing. categories for deletions should be listed at WN:DR. Heres what I think of your list (Thats my personal opinion which is not backed by policy) (Me is in bold) (User:Doldrums has struck off items dealt with by that user)
It was deleted quite a while ago because it was considered an encyclopedic category and a breeding ground for POV problems. —this is messedrocker (talk) 08:28, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] possible CfDs

anything I didn't comment on I agree with deleting

[edit] copyright/fair use question.

would the images discussed at Commons:Commons:Deletion_requests/Archive/2006/06#Image:21july-london-bombings-suspect1.jpg be useable here under publicity/fair use in Metropolitan Police release photographs of July 21st suspects? Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 23:42, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

i think we can use this image released by the met. police in a press release, as publicity image. Also, Wikinews:Fair use says Crown Copy. images can be used provided "it is reproduced accurately and not in a misleading context" and source and copyright status marked. a copy of the four photos together on cnn is tagged with "Met. Police" as source (google image search for " 21 july london bombing suspects cnn " to see it). Doldrums 05:56, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
actually, since the deleted pictures themselves are from the press release listed as a source in the article, we should be able to use them as publicity images, crediting the source (the Met.) properly. Doldrums 04:34, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] For anyone looking for a non-controversial contribution (or not as the case may be)

I've spent today "stealing" dynamic templates from Wikipedia for navigating country portals. This has given us a more complete list of countries, and highlights cases where no portal has been set up for a country. (Look at all the redlinks created with {{North America}} on the North America Portal.

Can we fix the redlinks, but with some consistency that can be applied across pre-existing portals? If you're looking for a really interesting one, try Turkey, per what I lifted from Wikipedia it is in 3 of our regions and its inclusion in one is disputed. --Brian McNeil / talk 18:11, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

i created some African portals y'day (as Brian will know - he had to go back and redo them) for countries with atleast 5 stories in their categories. so used only the Latest Headlines list (eg. Angola). was there ever something decided about the use of flag vrs. map images in country portals? this post is just a reminder of the alternative layout for countries not well covered on wikinews, in case someone is planning a portal creation spree. Doldrums 02:49, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
Theres no real guidelines that I know of. Just don't overdo it. If the thing has five articles it doesn't need a main lead, and subdivded into 7 sections for crime & law, dissasters etc. There is template:geo-portal (as well as others) but theres mo common practice. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 03:24, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
as noted above, template:geo-portal is unusable for such low-coverage countries. what are the others? i might have committed a boo-boo by copy-pasting content instead of using templates. Doldrums 03:52, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
I did a few of the African ones today, sneaky use of {{PAGENAME}} meant it was just a paste, preview and save. The ones I had to do over was when I realised I couldn't include Template:Continents at the bottom of each region template. That was fixed using AutoWikiBrowser. I agree about geo-portal, it is overkill for all but a few cases, such as Portal:New Zealand - but that's been customised a lot. --Brian McNeil / talk 09:25, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] What exactly is original?

Obviously if you collect information yourself, in the real world, instead of from the media, that's original. But are articles based on press releases "original"? Are articles based on radio reports? -- Zanimum 16:54, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

No. —this is messedrocker (talk) 09:52, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
It should be noted that in the IWWC2 any thing not from a direct new source was considered original. (However personally I agree with MessedRocker). Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 01:52, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
Personally I disagree, press releases are generally not put out by the media but instead put out by organisations about events/things of interest. Alot of journalists rely on press releases for information. I think the definition of original reporting was that so long as it has not been through another news agency the source is original - Cartman02au (Talk)(AU Portal) 22:01, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Images question

(wasnt answered in miisc section! and I really want an answer)I was wondering about the use of images under fair use. Messedrocker uploaded Image:Australia_Zoo_mourners.jpg today from the BBC, referenced it and tagged it as a publicity shot. My question is that can any images from the BBC be used with valid fair use rationale. The text for the image says This work is copyrighted, but released for use in news and editorials., does that mean the BBC releases its photos in this way. I just wanted to know because there is no specific mention on the BBC site orWIkinews policy pages.

Also do other news agancies release photos in this way? I would imagine it likely. If so is there any way of compiling a list of media agencies from whom images can be used under fair use in this way. --Errant 00:10, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

NO, Never Ever Images from BBC or another news agncy are not fair use on Wikinews. Okay on wikipedia not wikinews. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 00:44, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
It wasn't from the BBC, it was from an image agency. Image agencies don't compete with news services, so it would qualify under fair use. —this is messedrocker (talk) 00:46, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
Yeah thats proablly okay. Directly from news sources is a big no-no though. Bawolff ☺☻image:smile.png 01:50, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
Hmm ok but the link provided with the image was from the BBC??? which is why I queried it! So really that image needs proper sourcing right? --Errant 01:53, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Newbie article

Hi,

I am a new user on Wikinews, though a long-time reader. Anyway, I wanted to post a news story. Since this is my very first, I want to see if I can get some input, just in case I missed / messed up something that is rather obvious to regular contributors. The draft article is here. Thanks. --AlexS 23:12, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spoken articles - offer and request

Hello everyone, you may have seen me before on the pages of this most worthy project...unfortunately I have yet to contribute anything of substance here, but in collaboration with another user, I think my contributions could make a positive impact. Specifically, I am interested in serving as a voice of Wikinews, reading articles or daily summaries or anything that the site would like to produce. Only problem is, I lack the time/knowledge to edit audio into something that sounds respectable, and thus I seek the audio-editing knowledge of another user. What I envision is that I could periodically read an article/summary and upload it, with another editor fixing it up and podcasting/RSSing/whatever-ing to the far corners of the world, where this website will fulfill its promise by bringing quality news and information to all. Anyway, if anyone wants to talk more about this, please email me (I don't check my user page here so frequently, thus email is the best bet.) Look forward to working with you and contributing...Paul 13:40, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pope comment reactions

Muslim world condemns Pope's criticism of Islam is in the middle of a pov dispute. Doldrums 04:14, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hi I need help

I orginially had this on wikipedia and they deleted it so this table has links on it that do not work on wikinews. How can i get the links to work here on wikinews so they will go to the correct sites on wikipedia?? Please help. unsigned comment by User:Kevinprior

I have replied to the the request for assistance on the user's talk page. --Chiacomo (talk) 05:06, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] question

When i used the w: when i finished editing everything the w: was included in the word do you know how to fix that?? Can you w: the date?

Kevinprior 00:03, 23 September 2006 (UTC) Is this page ok, will it be deleted?? Please let me know.

[edit] Admin Alert Question

Is there a warning or similar template message in relevance to be placed in pages of users that have their user pages made as a webhost or advertisement? Not really needed but just asking... Zer T 00:05, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Wikinews hasn't really gotten to the point where we have templates for every little thing, so you're best off making something. By the way, Kevinprior was indefinitely blocked because he continually disregarded warnings that Wikinews is not his personal web host. —this is messedrocker (talk) 00:07, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
I noticed about kevinprior.. I was monitoring him lately using recent changes... I wished I had admin powers but that will be a long time till I get there... unless I contribute alot. Zer T 00:18, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
Well, you've been on longer than me. Just go for it. Failing is learning. Thunderhead(talk) 03:57, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
Thanks.... I better start on Accreditation requests... Zer T 04:03, 23 September 2006 (UTC)
  • I'd like to point out to our new contributors that admin and accreditation issues do not prevent you from becoming a well-respected member of the community. In fact, if you work on the latter first (the respect) then the other two come easily. I took about a year and 1K edits before I felt I'd really learned and earned those privileges. If you try for them early then, yes you'll be disappointed, but no it doesn't mean you can't end up with those "perks". --Brian McNeil / talk 19:25, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] help with image

i need help to check if Image:Safia Ahmed-jan.jpg is ok to use under fair use (publicity). it is needed in Afghan women's rights official shot dead. if not, an alternative image is very welcome.

While the image has been taken from Reuters image bank [6], the attribution information there states that it is originally from a Afghan Ministry of Women's Affairs handout. it has been used here [7] with a somewhat unusual attribution. Doldrums 17:26, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

It appears as if Reuters is only syndicating an image copyrighted by the Afghan Ministry. With the tags "NO SALES NO ARCHIVES" they seem to acknowledge that they themselves do not own the rights to this image. {{Publicity}} should be fine. --+Deprifry+ 17:38, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
going ahead and using it. Doldrums 17:40, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
qn is, should we be doing anything special with the attribution in the caption, or shld i leave it as it is? Doldrums 17:47, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
The images caption on the websites clearly credits "Reuters" as the author.